Trades?

[BroncoFan1407]

Alright Chad, and Matt I'm going to apologize right off the bat here because I have a feeling you guys not going to like this one.

Now I know that you guys don't have to explain your reasoning behind the trades that you made, but I am seriously wondering about them. The first one I voted yes on, even though I think that it is significantly weighted in Chad's favor. Heyward-Bey may become a good receiver someday, and just because I think that the offense in Oak will doom him for the rest of his rookie contract doesn't mean that someone else doesn't have high expectations for him. A high 2nd round pick is way too high in my opinion, even though no one asked for it...

The second trade is a little more iffy to me. A top ten tight end and a first round draft pick (albeit 2012) from the only winless team left in the league this year for a backup DE that was chosen in the 3rd round of the real draft (and our draft) and a safety that only had 2 good years in his last 5 and hasn't been healthy enough to play yet this year. This just doesn't look right to me, does anyone else agree?

I just wanted to ask about this before I voted on the 2nd trade. Again, I apologize for the antagonistic feel to the post, but I'm not quite sure I understand what is going on here.

Joey
BroncoFan

[CANES]

While I understand your concern. You know as well as everyone that nothing fishy is going on here. We are just trading as we have always done. Everyone has different values when it comes to players and draft picks. You may like some players more than me and vice versa. You cannot judge a trade simply on your feelings toward specific players.

The DHB deal was for a 2011 2nd round pick. While you may not like it. There is nothing wrong with this deal. You say "high" second round pick, but you don't know if that pick will be high or not. It is 2 years from now. Considering DHB was a 2nd round pick in the draft this year, I think a 2nd round pick 2 years from now is very reasonable.
In the second deal, I believe you can chalk it up how Matt and I value draft picks versus particular players involved as well as team needs. Matt had a TE to spare since he has three and can only start 2 therefore he was wanting to trade him. While I agree B. Sanders has yet to play this year, everyone knows the potential he has. He is a stud when healthy. Matt feels he will return to that form and help is DB corp as do I. You may not believe that, but we do. Michael Johnson is another player that you may not like but in the end, If Matt believes he will turn into a special player down the road and give him a good DE (which are hard to come by), how can you argue with that? In the end, its not like we are talking about a 1st next year as the last part of this deal, we are talking about a 1st 3 years from now. Doesn't matter if he is winless right now. That doesn't effect that pick. None of us know where our teams will be 3 years from now. Thats a long time and a lot can change. Hell, Matt could win the league and that pick could be 1.12. Just look at CSWS if you don't believe that can happen.

I understand your concern Joey, and have no issues with you saying anything. But there is nothing wrong with these trades other than the fact that you think they are lopsided. Which is fine. Thats your opinion.
I didn't like the last trade between Andy and Anthony (involving J. Allen) cause I think giving up a stud DL, which I think is hardest position to find a stud, for a OL (albeit a Saints) is very lopsided. But that is just my opinion. I know nothing fishy was going on, just different opinions/ values on players/ positions in the end.

I know I didn't have to explain myself, but I am more than happy too :) There are always going to be trades that we like and dislike. Its the nature of the game. I love this league and the guys in it. We have been going strong for many years now and I look forward to many more.

[CANES]

Alright Chad, and Matt I'm going to apologize right off the bat here because I have a feeling you guys not going to like this one.

Now I know that you guys don't have to explain your reasoning behind the trades that you made, but I am seriously wondering about them. The first one I voted yes on, even though I think that it is significantly weighted in Chad's favor. Heyward-Bey may become a good receiver someday, and just because I think that the offense in Oak will doom him for the rest of his rookie contract doesn't mean that someone else doesn't have high expectations for him. A high 2nd round pick is way too high in my opinion, even though no one asked for it...

The second trade is a little more iffy to me. A top ten tight end and a first round draft pick (albeit 2012) from the only winless team left in the league this year for a backup DE that was chosen in the 3rd round of the real draft (and our draft) and a safety that only had 2 good years in his last 5 and hasn't been healthy enough to play yet this year. This just doesn't look right to me, does anyone else agree?

I just wanted to ask about this before I voted on the 2nd trade. Again, I apologize for the antagonistic feel to the post, but I'm not quite sure I understand what is going on here.

Joey
BroncoFan

Oh and its not like I was trading away J. Cutler for K. Orton. That would of been a awful deal. ;)

[Tu Meke]

Just so BroncoFantradeyourbestplayer1407 doesnt feel alone, I too thought the Owen Daniels trade was slightly off, however I dont believe it should have been voted against.

Wondering what I will get for an early first rounder next year????

[CANES]

Here are a couple of your trades in past two years Joey….tell me if these trades don’t look “off” now.
2009 2nd, 2009 3rd, 2009 4th for Plaxico Burress (CEREBRALS and BroncoFan1407)
Stephen Cooper, 2009 3rd for Devin Thomas (Go Gators! And BroncoFan1407)
And going back 2 years…..
2010 1st and Andre Johnson for Brett Favre, Javon Walker, and 2008 3rd. (BroncoFan1407 and Mean Machine)

All these deals might of looked good when they were originally done, but you can see now that they look like horrible deals.

Not trying to single you out as I could probably go back through everyone’s trades (including mine) and find some that look like bad deals now. It does however show you that you just never know how a deal will turn out in future no matter what your opinion of it in the current time. Everybody has their own crystal ball on player/draft pick values.

This is precisely the reason in my opinion that EFS rules state:


Voting No
As a general rule, a No vote should be a rare occurrence in your league.

NOTE: One of the most destructive forces in a league is when owners abuse their trade voting privileges and start to veto legitimate trades out of spite or jealousy.

Trade voting is in place to stop collusion, team dismantling, or anything not deemed in the best interest of the league.

Collusion Two owners get together and decide to make a trade that benefits one owner while the other owner receives nothing of any value in return, creating a tremendous advantage to only one owner.

Trade Dismantling An owner who has decided to quit EFSports, but as a parting shot tries to make his team such a disaster, that even the best owner would need several years to fix it and make it competitive.

Best Interest An owner is intentionally trying to alter the competitive balance in the league in a negative way.

Trade Voting is not in place to prevent teams from getting stronger. Nor to frustrate owners attempts at improvements. It is not there to second-guess owner strategies, or to prevent owners from making shrewd or stupid moves. Trade Voting is not in place to stop one-sided trades, lop sided trades, stupid trades, or incompetent trades. Trade voting exists only to stop illegal trades or trades of evil intentions.

Tip: An owner who votes NO, should give the league the courtesy of a league wide email, or posting In the league forums explaining why he believes that trade is in violation of (Collusion, dismantling, best interest). This keeps things in the open, and will allow the trading partners to explain their motives.

NOTE: An owner who votes NO or YES can change his vote during the voting period.

[BroncoFan1407]

Just an FYI, I have decided not to vote on this trade. I am not responsible for the NO vote. I have a few more very compelling arguments (or at least they seem compelling to me) but in the end I'm not going to cause hard feelings in a league as great as this. Its not as big a deal as say trading Jacobs, Faine, Boley, Polamalu, Taylor and a 1st for Adrian Peterson :)

Joey
BroncoFan

[hardyac]

Ahhh.....finally some good discussion!

The only reason we are even discussing this is because of our competitive spirits....that is why this league and the owners are great.

I agree with BF and Miami, this one is probably best now to let go....both parties have said their piece.

That said, I DO appreciate BF expressing his concerns in the manner he chose...a very professional manner and should continue moving forward if future concerns exist....well done.

Besides, who could question a trade like Tom Brady + JPeppers + (whatever else I included at that time) for Reggie "Screen Pass" Bush?

Oh yeah...did anyone see that I beat Miami Swagger last week?

[CANES]

Just an FYI, I have decided not to vote on this trade. I am not responsible for the NO vote. I have a few more very compelling arguments (or at least they seem compelling to me) but in the end I'm not going to cause hard feelings in a league as great as this. Its not as big a deal as say trading Jacobs, Faine, Boley, Polamalu, Taylor and a 1st for Adrian Peterson :)

Joey
BroncoFan

I respect a non-vote (silent protest). I have done that a few times when I don't like a trade. :)

[CANES]

Ahhh.....finally some good discussion!

The only reason we are even discussing this is because of our competitive spirits....that is why this league and the owners are great.

I agree with BF and Miami, this one is probably best now to let go....both parties have said their piece.

That said, I DO appreciate BF expressing his concerns in the manner he chose...a very professional manner and should continue moving forward if future concerns exist....well done.

Besides, who could question a trade like Tom Brady + JPeppers + (whatever else I included at that time) for Reggie "Screen Pass" Bush?

Oh yeah...did anyone see that I beat Miami Swagger last week?

Andy, I didn't bring up that Brady trade cause that has to be the single worst trade ever in EFS! ;)

And yes, everyone noticed you beat me 2 weeks ago. You have been going on and on about it like it was your first time. Glad to see it means so much to you to beat me though. As long as your happy, I am happy.:rolleyes:

That had to be your highest score in 3 years wasn't it.........

[hardyac]

Big players make big plays in big games....said the CEREBRAL coach.

No comment was offered from Miami Swagger (atleast we think this is the latest team name?!?!)

YYYeeeeaaahhh!

[Tu Meke]

I hate Jared ALLEN.

I'm pretty sure he was dogging it when he was with my team. I blame his agent for forcing the trade. Last 2 weeks - ALLEN 95 points / J.EVANS 35 points. Not cool.

Still, I've got a rebuilding plan and am sticking to it.

[CANES]

I hate Jared ALLEN.

I'm pretty sure he was dogging it when he was with my team. I blame his agent for forcing the trade. Last 2 weeks - ALLEN 95 points / J.EVANS 35 points. Not cool.

Still, I've got a rebuilding plan and am sticking to it.

Bet you think that Allen/ Evans trade is slightly off now don't you :p

Gotta love this game.

[Tu Meke]

Bet you think that Allen/ Evans trade is slightly off now don't you :p

Gotta love this game.


I dont think the trade was off, just the owner of my team, (which would be...............me):D